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Working Class

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President Camacho

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Working Class

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Look what this student wrote in the ACA thing we got going on.

"I guess I will get things started off here :)
The first line of any book is always important. If it captures are attention chances are we will keep reading but if it is dull and uninteresting chances are we won't get to far in the book.
I love love love the first like on "Anna Karenina"
In Russian it is ""Все счастливые семьи похожи друг на друга, каждая несчастливая семья несчастлива по-своему."
In English it is ""Happy families are all alike; every unhappy family is unhappy in its own way"
This line captures my attention and makes me think already. What is happiness? What makes a person happy and unhappy?
This is a very interesting statement. First off are the any truly happy families? In my opinion no. Every family has their own problems and difficulties but working together and solving these is what makes us a family. Every family is in some sense unhappy. We don't see any of those cookie cutter families. Life is full of problems and difficulties and we all face unhappiness."




This got me thinking... People have needs and when certain needs are met we seek other desires, such as the need to secure food and shelter before I buy a car stereo - if I'm smart. So what's needed to make a happy family? We all have character flaws so there is really no helping that beyond a steady regiment of morally correct and ethical behavior. But we all know that morals and ethics are a luxury! I will steal a loaf of bread if my family is starving and I hope you would too as long as it's not stealing the one I've just stolen. Food and shelter are a necessity for life but not being secure in the knowledge that you will have these necessities tomorrow causes extreme stress. Stress, if serious like this one, can become an obstacle to happiness. They can make a person reject or forget about other desires and concentrate on that one thing. A drowning man may pull down someone he loves in panic. We're not talking really about personality flaws anymore... we're talking about tangibles that can be readily changed.

If the nation is worried about the decline of the family unit, why is it making living on one income close to impossible? Why is the disparity between rich and working class incomes increasing? Why are the rich getting tax breaks while teachers are losing their jobs? If I'm losing my job - you can bet my level of family happiness will probably soon go into the toilet because I will be without means to provide my family with food and shelter.
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geo

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Re: Working Class

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Maslow's hierarchy.

In order to become self-actualized, our basic needs have to be met. The inequity of wealth in our country is a sad state of affairs. Not that I'm against capitalism per se, but it's a shame that the top 20% controls about 85% of the wealth.
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lady of shallot

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Re: Working Class

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Actually Pres C. I do know a happy family. Not giddily happy but content and secure. This is my daughter's family. They are husband and wife two kids. The parents met when they were 18 and married 9 years later. They finished school and the husband got a MA in business. Had first baby at 30. My son in law is very successful (I believe) they have a nice but not extreme lifestyle. My daughter is not employed but works almost full time as a volunteer in their excellent school system. The key to the happiness in this family I think is the personalities of the parents. They are both very calm and capable. They do not holler, they are attentive to their children but not smothering.

They go with the flow. When my granddaughter was a little girl and was being put to bed she used to say how much she regretted that the passing day was over that it had been a perfect day. Who wouldn't like a grandchild to be able to say such a thing? The children were encouraged but not exactly indulged. their interests were always considered but they were not driven. They never acted out or misbehaved (no drugs, drink etc.)

Geo, why should I care if 20% of the population controls 85% of the wealth? I see how hard "wealthy" people work. We CHOSE to move to Maine (where the cost of living is high and the salaries low) because we did not want the stress of living in new york anymore. Not everybody is suited by disposition to want to work hard, to want to be prudent or financially secure. Probably one of the wealthiest couples of my acquaintance do not spend any money. Never rent a dvd or go to a movie. they do travel if they get a terrific deal. When they eat out they share a meal. Buy clothes at yard sales, pick up bottles at the beach for the 5¢ deposit. I know how they live and I would never choose to live that way despite the probably very real wealth they have.

When we see all the new fortunes in this country made by rock stars, entrepreneurs (like Martha Stewart) the Bill Gates & the guy from facebook, we realize that if one desires it one can make it, maybe even by being just like my friends.

Not everyone desires wonderful material things so they see no need to work hard to achieve them. I don't really care about diamonds and gold and land rovers etc. I like lots of things but they can be books and china. What I wanted I worked for to achieve and frankly I am more than a little annoyed about all this talk about school teachers who in most areas make more than the average salary.
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Re: Working Class

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I just want to add another paragraph. My dad had three years of college in 1929 when the stock market crashed. Because he also had a daughter at the time and a son on the way he took a blue collar job in another state because he needed a job. He worked all the rest of his life at that job (with a hiatus to join the Navy in 1943 when he had 6 children!) He told me once that he thought if he could just earn $50 a week he would be on easy street.

Although both our parents had additional education to high school, none of the six of us was offered that (three of us did go later) between us we had 18 children. Most of us struggled financially but we also saw that most of our children went to college. Three of them have terminal degrees, one is a surgeon, one a successful lawyer, one has a doctorate. Many of the others are financially successful too. Now the lawyer's mother went to work when her youngest was five at Syracuse university so the children could go there tuition free. Four of the five children did and the oldest is the lawyer who does have a very nice life style.

So I ask you, what good does it do to work hard, struggle so your kids can get a nice education, get a good job and work hard at that job, so others can just resent you and criticize your?
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Re: Working Class

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Does it matter what others think of you or what they say? Providing for your family and striving to give them the best life you can should be what you are concerned about, not what others are saying behind your back.
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Re: Working Class

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AMEN khogg.
Money doesn't buy happiness.
It can help bring about happiness and joy, but I have learned from experience the richest family around can be the most unhappy family in the whole town and the poorest family in the town can be the most happiest family around.
You should get the pleasures out of life just being with the people you most care about, not money or other materialistic items.
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President Camacho

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Re: Working Class

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Funder, that's not only romantically cliche' but naive to think that the happiest people go home smelling the worst at night. Money may not be integral to a small minority's happiness but it is for the vast majority of people when we're talking about family happiness.

Khogg, Everyone cares to some extent what others think. It's a large part of a functioning society to have its members constantly consider others. In the U.S., trends are evident in the most superficial aspects of life such as clothes and wrist bands. We're also a highly competitive society where worth is largely based on wealth. Like you said, "Providing for your family and striving to give them the best life you can should be what you are concerned about...". If everyone has this mindset they would be motivated to become wealthy so as to provide them with the best home, food, education, clothing, and every other benefit that money can buy. When you have someone that's too poor to pay for their child's college, go ask them if they are happy about that. That parent may come from a "happy" family but not having the funds to pay for their child's education is a point of stress, disappointment, failure, and (go look up an antonym for happiness and place it here).

There is nothing wrong with having romantic ideas but it's all too easy to allow your head to float up in the clouds when it comes to "love". When thinking about family happiness, I think people have love and loyalty in mind. Although there is nothing wrong with the dream of romantic love, it's usually just that: a dream. People need to be more realistic and if they truly want happiness they need to find not only a compatible mate but to find ways to eliminate stress in their life. Having wealth eliminates a lot of stress.

When working class Americans earn less, their stress level rises. Prices of goods keep rising. Gas is pushing 4.00 a gallon and wages remain stagnant. I'm curious to see what future inflation will be like.

What infuriates me is that instead of people looking out for those in a similar situation to themselves, they prop up those who are wealthier than they are. Instead of looking out for someone who lives down the street, they're grouping themselves and throwing in their lot with people who live on Mt. Olympus as though they are a god of industry themselves. These people shout, "Why harm the successful like me?" When they are nothing but ants compared with these people. These men and women of enormous wealth hold in contempt the people who shout these slogans as much as the doctors and lawyers do who are against teachers keeping their weak little union. It's disgusting to watch these people protect those who they have NOTHING in common with. The rich must be laughing their ass off at these people who make a meager 100-200k per year and wondering how they managed to get such loyal and loud sheep to bleet for them. Don't even get me started on people who make less than that complaining about teachers' salaries. That just blows my mind.
lady of shallot

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Re: Working Class

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President C.:
When you have someone that's too poor to pay for their child's college, go ask them if they are happy about that.
This is exactly the situation we found ourselves in when our daughter was applying to college(s) I encouraged her to apply to any college she was interested in. She applied to William & Mary, Carnegie Mellon, Skidmore, Bates, Colby, and Utica. all accepted her but Wm & Mary. She chose Bates which we were pleased with as it is close (no travel expenses) her tuition was 44% of our income at that time. Of course we could not afford that much. She got many scholarships and did have loans (which we paid back. . . I don't think kids should have to start life burdened with debt) so it can certainly be done. Our granddaughter is now going to Bowdoin. the tuition is something like 53K. Half the student body receives help.

Overall Pres. I agree with your comments. I think maybe the two other respondents are young people.
Don't even get me started on people who make less than that complaining about teachers' salaries. That just blows my mind.
Please reassemble your mind as I am one of those people. Don't forget it is property taxes (by and large) that are paying the education expenses. 70% of our tax bill goes to the schools in our town. Other services (that serve the town as a whole) suffer. The teacher/pupil ratio is 13 to 1. A lot of home owners in our town live on retirement incomes and are elderly. Anything to do with the schools and children is sacrosanct. Our income was never any higher than that earned by a school teacher but our hours of working were much longer and much less secure.

One thing I do agree with you about is the sometimes elitist attitude of the those with more to those with less. (this is not always so) we had a big fight with our town council about our neighborhood. The issue was not wanting something implemented here. One of our town councillors (they of course are all from higher income levels) said what did we care what happened in our neighborhood as we had a gas station nearby! You better believe I tell everyone, who said that and when. However I have also had a phone call I made to an extremely wealthy & high placed lawyer (someone with connections to the highest political levels also) picked up by him immediately and this was pro bono advice!
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President Camacho

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Re: Working Class

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Reassemble my mind? That's a lot to ask of an internet acquaintance. ....lol, ok I see what you're saying now.

Taxes pay for a lot of useless and overpriced crap. I'm happy to see that rather than go after all the pure sh*t - we're going after the people who are RAISING the next generation of Americans. Priorities.....Priorities.... Fox News will channel your rage against taxes to suit its own conservative agenda.

These men and women, who drive used beaters and wear outdated clothing, have Masters and Specialist degrees very early on in their careers. They continue their education throughout their careers and they deal with things which can't be taught and only come from experience - such as the many different personalities of children and how to reach them. They are educators, entertainers, psychologist, police, Mom, Dad, and friend all rolled into one person. This person interacts more with your child on a daily basis than any other adult outside your family.

Don't you want this person to be of quality? Do you get what you pay for?

If you want less taxes, I'd advise the taxpayer to go after something else. I guarantee you if you take money away from a working person your lawmakers will ensure that it goes to another person. The taxes will not disappear and they will not decrease. You're only taking money away from your neighbors pocket and giving it to a suit.
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Re: Working Class

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These men and women, who drive used beaters and wear outdated clothing,
Are you kidding? I don't know what the school teachers are like where you live but that is not the case here! I have a friend in my neighborhood who thinks she is more than amply paid by the school system. A woman across the street retired in the past year or two from being a grade school principal (the first teaches special needs kids) says she was always well paid. Neither of these people drive "used beaters and wear outdated clothing"

But that is how we live!

I don't watch Fox news, nor do I have a rage against taxes. We don't earn enough to pay taxes! Except for property and sales taxes (sales tax in Maine is only 5%)

I have a niece that teaches 2nd grade ( 186 days a year) and she earns almost 100K. Another one teaches kindergarten and first grade. She lives on the sound in Connecticut.

All the things you say about teachers have always been true of teachers, except now they have on site psychologists (at least they do in my grandkids school system) Of course I want quality education for our students, but where is it? For all the tax dollars? Have you heard the grammar used by some young people?
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