To spank or not to spank?

[NaddiaAoC]

Nope, sorry, this isn't a sex poll. My daughter is nearly 2 years old and I've watched her change from a perfectly sweet little pixie into the spawn of Satan. She used to give me hugs. Now she smacks me in the face, pulls my hair and bites. She used to do what I would tell her. Now she looks at me with defiance and does the opposite. I started out this parental role strongly opposed to spanking, but I've been rethinking that position. How do you folks feel about spanking children? I would really like some elaboration from parents who have experienced the nightmare of toddlerhood. How have you dealt with this type of behavior?CherylResults (total votes = 12):Beat that ass 'til they can't sit no more.&nbsp1 / 8.3%&nbsp Spanking is my first line of punishment, but I don't beat them.&nbsp1 / 8.3%&nbsp Spanking is sometimes necessary, but it's my last line of punishment.&nbsp6 / 50.0%&nbsp How can you smack your child and then tell them to not hit you? Spanking is never appropriate.&nbsp2 / 16.7%&nbsp Other - please specify.&nbsp2 / 16.7%&nbsp 

[Chris OConnor]

I'm not a parent yet, so I really am not sure how I will handle things. My mind currently is with the, "only in dire situations" camp, as spanking to me is like saying, "it's ok to use violence to solve your problems." But my brother and I have discussed it, and to him spanking is the only way to break through in extreme situations with very young children. You cannot exactly reason with a 3 year old about the importance of not running into the street.Chris "The man who does not read good books has no advantage over the man who cannot read them"

[deannafrances]

I hope this helps you. I am a grandmother and have raised three very fine adults--who are currently all good citizens and who went to college and got married -- just so you know noone is in prison or a doper. I believe that a certain age--when children are young--they need discipline and guidance and sometimes when they are little --a quick slap on the hand and a firm no is better than going to the hospital because they turned on the stove or ran away from you in the mall parking lot. As for biting--I know for a factthat they do not realize it hurts and as strange as it may sound when your child bites you before you smack them alongside the head or have them bite your neighbor or grandmother--you have to tell them --biting hurts and more or less show them your teeth and then just bite a tiny bit on their skin and SHOW them it hurts. How will they know??--after all an apple doen't scream in pain when you bite into it. For all the explaining modern parents do --sometimes I think they don't explain the FACTS and physical nature of life --instead they try and appeal to a 2 year's sense of justice? morality?fairness? and you can't --being a small child is all about yourself---you have to learn to share the world.

[Niall001]

Yes, you should when its warranted. Just make sure that the punishment is immediate. Its plain straight forward conditioning. So long as you don't overuse it and don't use it as an outlet for your frustration, its acceptable.

[Hestiasmissives]

I have one 14 year old daughter. I did not spank her and to date she has refrained from biting or hitting anyone else. At 2 she was definitely testing her independence. My solution to her strong will was and still is lots of fresh air and exercise. At two, I would take her 1/4 to 1/2 mile away from home and let her walk back ahead of me just so she could show me. It must have helped her endurance too because this year she ran a half marathon and won her age group.

[deannafrances]

I just wanted to add---yes it has to be immediate--not wait until your father gets here kind of scare tatic. And not harsh--no real bruising or poundings. And it definitely depends on the kidI had three kids and one --just a look from me was enough to make her stop but one of the boys was a real pistol and needed to be supervised every minute and "no" was not enough --it just meant I'll try my bad behavior a different way. And of course --every night you love and hug and kiss your child --no going to bad mad and I never ever said "I hate you". Hope this all helps.

[Kostya]

We have a 13 year old whom we never spank and as far as I can tell she is growing up to be a decent human being. She is definitely not hurting anyone and is basically a normal teenager.My parents never spanked me and I think that I turned out to be OK. Well, this of course is a matter of opinion. I guess the question is "What are you trying to accomplish with a spanking?" Is there a situation when whatever you are trying to communicate to your child with a spanking cannot be achieved with other, less violent measures? I cannot think of one. If it is punishment you are after, I think that there are other ways to punish a child that work much better. Taking away their things and privileges works just fine. If you are trying to teach them something

[NaddiaAoC]

Thank you for the comments, folks. I appreciate your input.Kostya said:Quote:I guess the question is "What are you trying to accomplish with a spanking?" Is there a situation when whatever you Iare trying to communicate to your child with a spanking cannot be achieved with other, less violent measures? I cannot think of one. How about in a public place like a restaurant? A couple weeks ago I took my daughter to the local atheist meetup dinner. I couldn't even have a conversation with other adults because the entire time she was smacking me and throwing her food on the floor and screaming to get my attention. I tried everything I could think of to get her to settle down without spanking her. Nothing worked. Taking away privileges only works if you have them to take away. What can I take away in a public setting like that? I had no control over my child. She was a public annoyance and I eventually had to get up and leave because she was disturbing other customers and I was physically exhausted from trying to handle her. I had no control over her behavior.Since then I have decided to try spanking her. I don't spank her hard. I don't need to. A slap on the hand or a swat on her bum with my hand is all she needs, and now she doesn't even need that most of the time. If she starts to pull my hair or if she throws something at me I say, "Andrea, do you want a spanking?" And immediately she stops. I can now take her out in public places again and she's very good. I've had no more issues with her being a little monster.Quote:But I think that when you resort to physical punishment you effectively loose in the long run even though it might feel like you achieved your short-term goals.How do you lose in the long run? What long-term problems result from mild physical punishment? How violent is a slap on the leg and do children perceive that as violence? Quote:I think that children deserve the same amount of respect as any adult even if they are being difficult or do not understand what you are talking about. No normal person would think it is OK to hit a retarded man if he does not understand that he should not run into the street. Does my kid deserve less?I agree that children deserve dignity and respect. They are little people, not punching bags. However, children do not reason on the same level as adults so the same methods of communication do not always work on them. I'm definitely opposed to using physical punishment as mere behavior modification. I think that there should always be an explanation along with it. However, a 2-year-old who is slapping you in the face and then throwing a temper tantrum in the store when you try to restrain her hand doesn't give a damn about your explanation. It seems to me (and I could be wrong) that I first have to get her attention before I can even attempt to reason with her and the only thing I've found so far that will even get her to listen to me is physical punishment, or at least the threat of it.As for not hitting a retarded man, that's not my position. I'm not responsible for his behavior or how he turns out in the long run. If my only concern is keeping an individual safe then surely I can do that without physical punishment (although physical restraint may be needed at times). However, if I have a responsibility to make sure this child successfully grows and develops into a decent adult I need to find ways of establishing parental authority. I wouldn't smack her hand for a "wrong action," rather for a defiant attitude. A 2 year old doesn't understand the dangers of running into the street. It's my job to teach her and protect her from doing so. I would not spank her for that. However, it's also my job to instill a parental respect in her so that I can do that job, so that she will listen to me. If I put her shoes on because we're leaving the house to go shopping and then she turns around and takes them right back off I'm not going to spank her. I'm going to verbally correct her by explaining to her that the shoes need to go back on. However, if she picks that shoe up, scowls at me, and then throws it at me with defiance she gets her hand slapped. I'm not talking about using physical punishment for behavior modification. I'm talking about establishing authority as a parent. I don't know how to do that without using some mild spanking. Nothing I've tried up to this point has worked. I don't want a bratty, defiant child who will not listen to a word I say. Nobody wants to be around a kid like that, including me.Quote:Think about teachers, they are not allowed to hit kids and yet good teachers are able to keep children in line. Our teachers are living proof that it is possible to not resort to violence.Most teachers are teaching older children. There's a world of difference between trying to reason with a 6 year old and a 2 year old. Besides that, I'm not sure that I would agree that a "good" teacher is always able to keep kids in line. There are many teachers who complain about how difficult it is to control their classes in public school systems. Does this necessarily make them poor teachers? I think it's wonderful that you never had to spank your daughter. I never intended to spank mine. However, I think perhaps it's different with each child. Some are more stubborn than others. Also, circumstances will vary. I don't know your home situation, but if your daughter received a lot of attention from her mother she may not have demanded as much. I am divorced and my daughter stays with her father for 3 days a week. She stays with me the other 4. So often when I get her back after not seeing her for a few days she wants my attention to the exclusion of everyone else. If I try to have a conversation with anyone else she becomes obnoxious and will often start hitting me and pulling my hair. She's mean about it. I try to give her a lot of attention with I'm with her, but she still has to learn that annoying behavior like that is unacceptable. I appreciate your input, Kostya. This parental role is new to me and I have no parents or close friends to turn to for advice. I've done quite a bit of reading on various parenting styles and as a result I've leaned heavily toward the idea of not spanking. However, as good as that approach sounds in text it's simply not working for me. I haven't had to spank my daughter often or hard, but the few smacks I've given her have made so much difference. I feel like I have a little control again and she's not a hellion to be around.Cheryl

[Kostya]

Quote:How about in a public place like a restaurant?I don't have a predefined solution for every situation. In this case, perhaps leaving the restaurant, lecturing your daughter about it and taking away some of her favorite toys or TV privileges would do the trick. I don't know

[pctacitus]

My other method is simple. Force the child to face a wall on their knees, shins in contact with the floor, make their body sit up straight, and hold their arms straight up. Roughly in an L shape. The British Army used to use this method for prisoner training, it wears them down, not to mention failure to comply was punished in a physical manner, but the lack of violent intent kept them from violating the Geneva Convention. Don't ask me what my parents did, because my sister (by the way, your child can't be the spawn of Satan, my sister doesn't have any kids) and I were too smart, too strong-willed, and too good at keeping anyone from knowing for certain we were responsible. We took sibling rivalry to a level I haven't heard of outside of royal families where heirs kill one another for the throne. Even then, it was about power, not personal animosity.