Am I an athiest?

[johnson1010]

Chris:

I agree with Katelyn. We should never allow facts to get in the way of our faith. It is better to completely avoid all contact with the facts.

God bless you all.

ho ho, wow!

She thanked you!

Social conservatives and subtlety. A tragic story.

[Dexter]

No, I am not. It's also the fact that my mother would kill me if I watched something like that. Not literary, but you know.

That's some scary indoctrination going on there. Yes, I know you don't mean it literally, but still you're being sheltered from the outside world. I'm surprised you're allowed to converse with a bunch of heathens, better not get caught. Is reading or looking at a video really blasphemous to the God you believe in?

[Robert Tulip]

Katelyn said earlier that she watches television programs in which people curse. It is hard to understand a value system that allows people to watch cursing, and probably other bad things, but not to listen to true information.

[(author) Katelyn]

You know, this is stupid. Did you ever think yourself arguing with a 12 year old about religion? I do not watch things that curse. I turn them off. I cannot help that. Things are not always great for Christians. I'm not perfect. Here is a poem: When I say I am a Christian When I say, “I am a Christian”
I’m not shouting, “I’ve been saved!”
I’m whispering, “I get lost!
That’s why I chose this way”

When I say, “I am a Christian”
I don’t speak with human pride
I’m confessing that I stumble -
needing God to be my guide

When I say, “I am a Christian”
I’m not trying to be strong
I’m professing that I’m weak
and pray for strength to carry on

When I say, “I am a Christian”
I’m not bragging of success
I’m admitting that I’ve failed
and cannot ever pay the debt

When I say, “I am a Christian”
I don’t think I know it all
I submit to my confusion
asking humbly to be taught

When I say, “I am a Christian”
I’m not claiming to be perfect
My flaws are far too visible
but God believes I’m worth it

When I say, “I am a Christian”
I still feel the sting of pain
I have my share of heartache
which is why I seek His name

When I say, “I am a Christian”
I do not wish to judge
I have no authority
I only know I’m loved

Copyright 1988 Carol Wimmer


I love this poem. It is so true. I hope y'all reflect on it and understand that is what Christians are about. God bless.

[johnson1010]

Katelyn, I am not arguing with you.

You are serving as an example of the pitfalls of magical thought.

You have been confessing to anybody who happens across this thread that you think knowing things is evil. That ignorance is the path to godliness. That the believer cannot be swayed by logic, facts, reason, or even the bald fact of reality. Not only do you fail to see the truth, you reject even the idea of looking at it. You confess to a hopelessly biased, unyielding, blind determination to believe what you have been told to believe, and never step outside of the role given to you.

You demonstrate the central fault of faith in your insistence that you "know" something, without ever really even indicating what exactly it is you insist you know. You confess ignorance in topics that people have spent literally millions of man-hours investigating, yet with faith proclaim that your studious dismissal of the subject and ignorance of it's contents should hold more weight than the tireless investigators who make that topic their life's work.

You don't know why people have hair, because you don't know why god has hair. We do. And it isn't special knowledge that comes from nowhere, indicated by nothing, disconnected from reality, with no impact on the way we live. We know why humans have hair because people went out and made it their business to know.

Do you think god gave you air conditioning, and heaters? Do you think God gave you carpets and furniture? Do you think god gave you the telephone and the automobile? Do you think god gave you the end of smallpox?

It isn't special revelation. it isn't restricted to a select few. It isn't only given the the privilaged. It is available to anyone who looks. And it isn't even hard to understand.

The entire world lays before us, and what seemed like secret knowledge can be plucked out of nature like a ripe apple, if you have the stones to look for answers.

You confess to ignorance, and so do I. The difference being I believe there is a cure for my ignorance. You simply throw a tarp over it and call it "god".

[VMLM]

I would like to steal a moment from all your lives, simply to say that I've spent the last half hour laughing heartily at the contents of this thread, and to thank you all for a mirthful morning. Especially Katelyn, you've got courage and I think you've been lucky to have a family you can have faith in. I sincerely hope life gives you a good whack in the head and wakes you up. Although I'm positive you'll live a happy, loving and productive life regardless.

Cheers.

[realiz]

Katelyn. I like the poem. Have you really read it though? Are you not judging the people who do not believe in God? Are you not telling us here that you know the truth in life? Did you not say that you wear the badge of 'Christian' with pride? This poem is an emotional 'feel good' poem for Christians, and contradicts reality, like much of christianity.

Asking questions, reading, and learning does not mean to turn your back on God. Christians all over the world are continually adjusting their beliefs as they grow and learn. It is not one package where you have to accept every single belief of your partical corner of chritianity in order to remain faithful. Convincing followers that they should question nothing and follow blindly is a control technique used by overzealous leaders. This does not come from God, but from man. Why would God not want you to learn?

Learn about what others believe and why they believe what they do. Use your own intelligence, not just your emotions, to weigh the merits of these beliefs. You have years and years ahead of you and discover the 'truth', your own truth, not one fed to you by one small group of society. Almost all religious groups around the world are pretty certain that they have the one and only 'truth'.

[(author) Katelyn]

@ johnson. What do you think we've been doing? Arguing. I did not say learning is wrong. I meant learning WICKED things. Okay? Thank you. I do know why we have hair, its to protect us from the sun and partical's in the air. No, God didn't make A/C, or ect. But He gave man the materials and knowledge to do so. @ Anyone who has said they've laughed, go ahead. Laugh. I don't care. But in the end, I will be laughing. No, crying. B/c I will feel sorrow for those who have rejected God. No matter what, no matter how mean and horrid people are to me and my family, how many times they mock God, I will always feel for those people. God bless.

[R. LeBeaux]

@ johnson. What do you think we've been doing? Arguing. I did not say learning is wrong. I meant learning WICKED things. Okay? Thank you. I do know why we have hair, its to protect us from the sun and partical's in the air. No, God didn't make A/C, or ect. But He gave man the materials and knowledge to do so. @ Anyone who has said they've laughed, go ahead. Laugh. I don't care. But in the end, I will be laughing. No, crying. B/c I will feel sorrow for those who have rejected God. No matter what, no matter how mean and horrid people are to me and my family, how many times they mock God, I will always feel for those people. God bless.

Still hanging in there? I'm impressed. Give 'em hell (which is what I suppose you want for most of us). Anyway, whatever your views, I think it's admirable that you don't shy away from the fight. I just wish you would listen to some of the responses and think about them, rather than having the knee-jerk, dogmatic reactions you do. If you opened your mind, you might just learn something. But, then again, probably not.

[Robert Tulip]

I did not say learning is wrong. I meant learning WICKED things. Okay? Thank you.

Hi Katelyn, thank you. This comment is very illuminating for how you have been taught. This morning at church we had Forest Sunday. Our preacher was Dr John Williams, a professor of soil science. His text was Genesis 1:1-13, the first three days of creation. He described his reverence for the spirit of creation of life, and compared the Genesis creation story to the conclusion of The Origin of Species by Charles Darwin. Here is the text he read out from Darwin:

"It is interesting to contemplate a tangled bank, clothed with many plants of many kinds, with birds singing on the bushes, with various insects flitting about, and with worms crawling through the damp earth, and to reflect that these elaborately constructed forms, so different from each other, and dependent upon each other in so complex a manner, have all been produced by laws acting around us. These laws, taken in the largest sense, being Growth with reproduction; Inheritance which is almost implied by reproduction; Variability from the indirect and direct action of the conditions of life, and from use and disuse; a Ratio of Increase so high as to lead to a Struggle for Life, and as a consequence to Natural Selection, entailing Divergence of Character and the Extinction of less improved forms. Thus, from the war of nature, from famine and death, the most exalted object which we are capable of conceiving, namely, the production of the higher animals, directly follows. There is grandeur in this view of life, with its several powers, having been originally breathed by the Creator into a few forms or into one; and that, whilst this planet has gone circling on according to the fixed law of gravity, from so simple a beginning endless forms most beautiful and most wonderful have been, and are being evolved."

This was from the sixth edition of his book, in which Darwin added 'by the Creator' because of the controversy. Darwin was open to the idea of a Creator, while recognizing that creation operates through consistent laws which science can discover. You are quite wrong to regard Darwin's reverence for the amazing grandeur of our world as "wicked". Your view on this really shows how you have been blinded by false teachings. Science is not wicked, it is good. If you really had reverence for God you would show more humility rather than asserting that you understand how God acted to create our world as literally described in the Bible. It did not happen in the way described in Genesis.