Richard Dawkins Explains Why There Was Never a First Human Being

[Chris OConnor]

[youkrst]

the Homo Climaxus revelation

sonoman, i sometimes think you should be a little more careful when choosing names for your revelations

[Chris OConnor]

Did Homo Climaxus come after Homo Erectus Maximus?

[DWill]

Did Homo Climaxus come after Homo Erectus Maximus?

I usually don't do LOL, but LOL!

"Homo Climaxus is both the defining example of continuous evolution within a species but instantly overthrows Dawkins notion that because the outward form is similar that the inward one has not taken a most significant physical leap forward with I would greatly suspect thicker corpus collossum connecting both brain hemispheres in the bicameral minded person."

That is at least something testable. But what if there proves to be no physical difference in the bicameral whiz brain? Then sonoman will have to retreat into immateriality again.

[Vishnu]

Our collective unconscious already is quite familiar with the idea and with genetic engineering that will be happening more and more creating bodies that can breathe water and swim efficiently is not so far fetched.

Now I know we are on two different pages about the subject matter. That's not the evolution Dawkins is talking about, nor what is meant by "man evolved from apes." That kind of evolution is done exclusively through breeding, i.e. natural selection, or in the case of when an external agent, such as man, guides the breeding as we did in the case of domesticated dogs, which is artificial selection as opposed to natural selection.

That is the kind of evolution that is meant in our common everyday usage when discussing origin of species (rather than the dictionary definition of simply "change"). Evolution not does not have some end goal "in mind" that we are striving towards, that we are already genetically predisposed to inevitably become some day. That's one of the things that irritates me about pop-culture's portrayal of it. One good example in recent memory is that cartoon called Ben-10 with his "Ultimatrix," a new version of his original device. This one not only changes him into other aliens, but a higher setting on it also "evolves" the species he currently is. That's not evolution, that's just mutation.

This genetic engineering you mention is exactly that- just genetic engineering. While it could possibly happen one day in the future (I guess), if it does not come about by selective breeding, then it did not come about by the evolution Dawkins refers to or the evolution we have been discussing in this thread. It is simply another topic altogether. Thus, no, it is not the case that "Homo Climaxus is both the defining example of continuous evolution within a species," and thus, no, Dawkins isn't obstinate to future mermen because of a lack of "bicameral" or "holistic" thinking. It's just that genetic engineering is something else entirely.

Also, the statement that "Dawkins notion that because the outward form is similar that the inward one has not taken a most significant physical leap forward" is wildly ignorant, as it is the "inside" that matters the most, or even at all. It is the genetic make-up that determines speciation, regardless of how similar two species appear on the "outside," thus whales are mammals while whale sharks are fish. Dawkins would never classify those two together as the same order of animal, and he would never do so precisely because of what they are composed of on the "inside."

Hell, sometimes there can be a greater difference in outer appearance among species of the same order than species of two different orders. Hence Robins and Pigeons (different orders) have a greater resemblance than a sea lion and a real lion (same order). Speciation occurs when two ends of a spectrum within a species genetically drift so far apart from each other that they can no longer produce viable offspring.

A species is often defined as a group of organisms capable of interbreeding and producing fertile offspring.

As even the Bible admits, " yielding fruit after his kind." When they can no longer yield fruit, they are not the same kind.

So where does this leave things like horses & asses? Most of the time they fail to yield fruit, as mules are typically infertile. Yet, once in a blue moon, a mule is known to give birth, yet that offspring too is infertile and never been shown to reproduce.

^THAT is an example of evolution in progress. They have obviously drifted far enough apart genetically that "yielding fruit" has become so difficult as to be impossible in practical terms, yet still possible on extremely rare occasions, which in turn does not "yield fruit" after it.

Examples of such speciation are also witnessed in what are called "ring species."

Excellent video explaining it:


Thus the "transitional species" between two different species are not those which occur linearly on a chronological timeline, but rather, those breeds in between to the two extreme ends of the spectrum which can no longer yield fruit with each other yet can still yield fruit with every breed in between the two of them. Id est, Breed 1A can yield fruit with Breed 1B, and 1B with 1C, 1C with 1D, but 1A can not yield fruit with 1D, and thus 1 has now evolved into two different "species"- 1A & 1D, and 1B & 1C are the "transitional forms." But they all live together simultaneously. It is only if 1B & 1C were to go extinct and/or be integrated into 1A & 1D, that we then have two distinct species with no living transitional form.

If your Homo Climaxus can still yield fruit with Homo Sapien, then it is not a different species. If it cannot, yet did not get that way through genetic drift from lack of consistent interbreeding, then it did not evolve, it just mutated through the artificial means you mentioned- genetic engineering.

You clearly never knew what you were talking about when you entered this thread. True to form for you. Perhaps you should inquire of whatever being is giving you these "revelations" to also reveal to you how to effectively communicate them in a convincing way.

[Taylor]

this form has been utterly exhausting, I mean I am pooped from all the reading. My head is still spinning
from overload. I say both sides win, or it could be both sides loose. Keep up the insults I needed the
laughs. Thanks for your hard work here, your all very impressive and dedicated to education and I applaud
your beliefs. I will be sure to follow your progress.

[johnson1010]

Great link Vishnu!

I added that to the end of my evolution thread.

http://www.booktalk.org/post116466.html